Posted by Chuck on August 28, 2017
Credit Cards

Published on August 28th, 2017 | by Chuck

192

Chase Memo: Customers Can Only Get One Sapphire Card (e.g. CSP Cardholders Can’t Get CSR) + 24 Month Wait for Bonus

A Chase insider sent over an important memo which Chase is sending out to their employees that as of August 27 it’s no longer possible to get more than one Sapphire card. (It’s now official on the Chase site.)

There are three Sapphire products: plain, Preferred, and Reserve. If you hold the Reserve or plain, you won’t be able to apply for a Preferred. If you hold the plain or Preferred, you won’t be able to apply for the Reserve. If you hold the Reser

No changes will take place at all for existing Sapphire cardholders. If you have two or three Sapphire cards, you’ll continue to hold them all.

The idea behind Chase’s Sapphire rule is somewhat similar to Citi’s 24-months rule, yet different. Citi allows us to hold multiple ThankYou cards and even earn the bonus on multiple ThankYou cards, it just requires a 24-month ThankYou-family break before getting a new bonus. Chase is going to the next level and disallowing us to get more than one Sapphire card at all. On the other hand, Chase’s rule is easier than Citi’s in the sense that closing or downgrading a card won’t reset the 24 months clock for the bonus.

Just be sure that: (1) you haven’t gotten any Sapphire bonus within 24 months, and (2) you don’t currently hold any Sapphire card, and then you’ll be able to both apply and get the bonus for a new Sapphire card. Out of caution, it might be worth waiting 24-months from the date bonus was received and not from the application date.

On a practical level that means if you have a Sapphire card or two and you haven’t gotten a Sapphire bonus in the past 24-months, you can product-change your Sapphires to become one of the Freedom cards and then apply right away. Might be smart to give a few day break to allow them to update their system.

The memo recommends product changing your current Sapphire card to the version you want (e.g. Preferred to Reserve or vice versa), but – assuming it’s been 24-months since your last Sapphire bonus – it could be smarter to downgrade to a Freedom card and then apply for the new Sapphire card directly to get the signup bonus (currently, 50,000 points on each).

It’s surprising to me that Chase has not updated the verbiage in the terms of the Sapphire cards to indicate that all Sapphires are considered one product.

I suspect that they first sent this out to bankers to make everyone aware of it, and soon they’ll make it clearer in the terms. For now, maybe they can claim that both are included in ‘current cardmembers of this credit card’, but it seems a bit of a stretch.

The bottom line here is two negative changes:

  • You can’t hold more than one Sapphire card (this change I think most of us can manage)
  • You have to wait 24 months from getting the bonus on either card before getting it again on another card (big negative change)

Huge thanks to reader D. for sending this our way.



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192 Comments on "Chase Memo: Customers Can Only Get One Sapphire Card (e.g. CSP Cardholders Can’t Get CSR) + 24 Month Wait for Bonus"

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YRK
YRK

That puts a Black hole type dent in my plans :'(
Cant pc before year 1 is over, right? CSP to CSR that is.

Frito Pendejo
Frito Pendejo

I already got the CSP and CSR bonuses and PCed them to Freedoms and they are now >1yr old. Would PCing one of these back to CSR be forbidden by these rules? I want to be sure I can PC back to CSR in the future in case I want to redeem a ton of banked UR at 1.5x through the portal.

eclipsor
eclipsor

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

jias
jias

Damn… I was waiting to be out of 5/24 next month to get the CSP and transfer the UR point to my CSR…What a bad thing.

Zach
Zach

Same here :/

Beth
Beth

yep, same here, have 4 days more in this long wait to get below 5/24 and CSP was first off the block. ugh

TomT
TomT

This could be a minor problem for those who opened a Fairmont card that recently got converted to a Sapphire Preferred, as Chase will not let you PC that converted card to anything else within 1 year of when the Fairmont card was opened. I know because I tried to convert mine to a Freedom Unlimited and escalated my request to a supervisor w/o success.

It seems unfair that they can PC it w/o following their own rules, and the leaves you stuck with a Sapphire Preferred that you have to close if you want to open a Sapphire Reserve. I already had a Sapphire Reserve, so I am holding onto my useless Sapphire Preferred for another 5 months when I can finally convert it to a Freedom Unlimited.

RAM
RAM

why not downgrade the Sapphire Reserve to a freedom and then upgrade the Preferred to Reserve?

TomT
TomT

I cannot PC my Sapphire Preferred to anything until 12 months from the open date of the original Fairmont card it replaced. That was opened 1/15/2017. Your suggestion would result in me having no Sapphire Reserve until 1/15/2018. I would lose the Reserve’s 3x earning on travel & dining, as well as its better 1.5 vs. 1.25 UR redemption value in the interim. Having a Freedom Unlimited now and its 1.5x everywhere would not offset that for me.

Bagira
Bagira

Really? That sucks, I was planning to PC my Fairmont/Sapphire to regular Freedom. I have both FU and F now and was thinking to get second F to take the benefits of 5x rotating categories on two cards. So I basically need to wait for one year before PCing, will they waive the AF in this case?

JTS
JTS

A known method is go CSP -> CS -> FU/F. I tried to PC the newly-converted CSP to FU but was told I can only PC to CS, so I did, then next day I called and PCed the newly PCed CS to FU without problem.

Jeff
Jeff

CSR customer from last September. Does this mean if I downgrade to Freedom, I am ineligible for a signup bonus on Sapphire Preferred until September 2019? Plan was to downgrade and pick up CSP.

BB
BB

Correct.

Slimguy
Slimguy

Where does it say that?

tennismenace3
tennismenace3

No, it isn’t correct. It says that you can’t have received a bonus in the last 24 months. Doesn’t have anything to do with opening, closing, or downgrading.

tennismenace3
tennismenace3

September 2018 (24 months from when you received the bonus–if it took you longer then base it on that) according to the memo.

BOS George
BOS George

I assume you mean 2018? You are ineligible for 24 months from receipt of a bonus.

Matt
Matt

I wonder how they will apply this to AUs and if we can get around it by removing an AU, having them get a card and then adding them back as an AU

DPK
DPK

I currently have the CSR, and my Fairmont card just got PC’d to a CSP, I was planning on downgrading the new CSP to a CS when the AF comes in a few days. Will they still allow me to do that?

Lrdx
Lrdx

The letter is clear, you can still do such PCs.

TomT
TomT

If your Fairmont card was opened less than 12 months ago, you will NOT be able to PC it to anything. I tried.

JTS
JTS

I just PCed my newly-converted CSP to CS then to FU all within a week after the fairmont-CSP conversion. Fairmont card only 6 mo old, so still very doable.

DPK
DPK

My Fairmont card was opened 24 month ago. I would have closed it when the first AF came up but I waited more than 30 days and between 30 and 90 days Chase changed the rule from 90 to 30 for a refund of the AF

VL
VL

I would think they would let you do that anyway (with AF refunded) since they changed the rules. Have you called and asked, or just assumed you will not get the refund?

Cory
Cory

there goes 50,000 points out the window

Jay
Jay

Yeah bummer, I was going to sign up for a CSP for 50k points in 5 months.

Cain
Cain

There goes 100k out the window for me after i already downgraded car last week.

Lrdx
Lrdx

Well then.

Can you please increase the CSR’s bonus so it’s actually better than the CSP’s? (50k vs 55k + first year free..)

gary
gary

Who are you talking to? Nobody here can increase any bonus levels. ??

Lrdx
Lrdx

Seriously?

Sa
Sa

Chuck can.

NinjaX
NinjaX

you mean chuck norris can. 5/24 doesnt apply to him. nor any T&C of any kind…

BlueEyes_Austin
BlueEyes_Austin

One thing that isn’t clear is if a product change from a Sapphire Product to a non-Sapphire product also triggers the 24 month lockout since it specifically states it is for closed accounts.

Lrdx
Lrdx

Read again, the 24 month starts when you earn the bonus.

BlueEyes_Austin
BlueEyes_Austin

“If an account is closed”

Lrdx
Lrdx

The sentence continues..

BlueEyes_Austin
BlueEyes_Austin

The sentence is perfectly clear–as written the 24 month lockout only occurs when an account is closed. What isn’t clear is if the actual policy as implemented will treat lockouts and product changes the same.

BlueEyes_Austin
BlueEyes_Austin

Product changes generally are not considered account closures–that’s my point.

Lrdx
Lrdx

I can’t interpret this in the way you do.

You are already not eligible to open a card when you had it’s bonus in the last 24 months. The new thing is that all Sapphires are treated as the same product now, like Citi does with TYP cards.

The “if closed” is there for CSRs to warn the customer not to close the account to work around this new only-one-Sapphire rule, because they might not open a new one.

MrDioji
MrDioji

I agree this is unclear. Especially with the application language not changing (yet?). If the 24-month applies across the board and makes it more similar to Citi’s new rule, then the “If an account is closed…” language just shouldn’t be there. Or it should state, “even if an account is closed, or downgraded, then….”

We’ll see.

Elmer
Elmer

-1

MrDioji
MrDioji

We’ll see.

Sa
Sa

fcuuuuuuk!
was about to travel to a branch and see if they will let me get a bite of the reserve.
but if they tell me that i am targeted for it, i am still applying.

MoreSun
MoreSun

I thought they discontinued the targeted/pre-approvals for the CSR months ago…

Lantean
Lantean

Please let us know, I wonder if in-branch pre-approval overrules this.

Sa
Sa

what do i know?! Once i try, meaning if the pre-approvals are going on and i am targeted, i will let you know. in about two weeks.

Lantean
Lantean

what do you mean? if you go to a branch now you can see right away if you’re targeted and then you can get an instant decision if you’re indeed approved.
why wait two weeks?

Elmer
Elmer

Sounds like he doesn’t live near a branch, but will be traveling near one in two weeks.

Sa
Sa

What Elmer said.

C
C

To ensure I understand correctly…if received a bonus on the CSR in the past 24 months, I cannot receive a bonus on the CSP even if I product change the CSR to a Freedom card first?

Guy Bucktastik
Guy Bucktastik

I’m glad I opened as many sapphire preferred and resrves as possible in my family.

Get it while you can, because you might not tomorrow.

I hope the more restrictive rules mean that the rest of the ur program will hold its value better.

Stephen
Stephen

Multiple DPs of people being denied yesterday and today. There is no get it while you can.

Guy Bucktastik
Guy Bucktastik

we got two csp’s and a csr….last year. we got it while we could. now you can’t.

bob wiley
bob wiley

Can I apply for both on the same day to get around this? I have no sapphires and have never had one.

Greg the Frequent Miler

I don’t see anything in the memo that suggests that the 24 month rule spans the three cards. Am I missing something? Or, is it just a guess that it will apply across Sapphire cards?

Greg the Frequent Miler

Nevermind, I see it in the last bullet now!

Ben O.
Ben O.

Last bullet point:

“If an account is closed, a customer will not be eligible for any Sapphire-branded credit card if they have earned a cardmember bonus on a Sapphire-branded product within the last 24 months”

I’m assuming that also means “if account is downgraded” – but maybe that’s a loophole?

BlueEyes_Austin
BlueEyes_Austin

That’s the point I am making above–I don’t expect it will end up being a loophole when this is implemented but it is some possible wiggle room.

Diplomatico
Diplomatico

I understand your point and think the wording leaves things open to interpretation as well.

CM

TBH, I’m surprised it took them so long! There’s no logical reason to have both CSR and CSP at the same time if not for the bonus, or for avoiding the annual fee (e.g., fee-free CSP in the CSR-off years).

OTOH, I was expecting to possibly get CSR all over again next year, but since I just finished the CSP min-spend a few days ago, sounds like I now have 24 full more months to wait until a CSR bonus again!

Perhaps a good point to hit AoR hard, and stop worrying about 5/24! (I should finally be at 6/24 now after the final 2 Chase cards got approved!)

P.S. I think it’s a very smart way to minimise the losses that they were tasked with — or would you rather have some CSR benefits cut-out? This change may also mean that they’ll be back with CSR bonuses above 50k, since folks could no longer double-dip the bonus.

BlueEyes_Austin
BlueEyes_Austin

This throws a real (and I am sure intended) wrench into calculating whether to keep a CSR open or not. Close it and you then can’t get back into the Sapphire products for 2 years.

I suspect we might see people dumping UR into CIP accounts…and that would be a ripe time for Chase to make some of the surveyed changes for different types of UR points..

MrDioji
MrDioji

This shouldn’t prevent you from upgrading a Feedom to a sapphire product, right?

Tbone
Tbone

What is a CIP account? I’m not familiar with that abbreviation. Thanks.

Mist Soalar
Mist Soalar

Chase Ink Preferred

RightNYer
RightNYer

My reading of it is that you can still get back into the Sapphire products within 2 years, just not with a bonus.

CM

Not really — it was recently reported that you’d only be approved by Chase if you’re eligible for the applicable bonus — doubt the policy would differ here.

Don
Don

This doesn’t make it explicit that upgrading/downgrading locks you out for 24-months. It only says that closing will prevent you from opening (and by extension earning) the sign-up bonus. This (to me) seems like it’s aimed at people who sign-up, earn the bonus, take advantage of the benefits then promptly close their account and get most of their annual fee back.

If I wasn’t lol/24, I’d volunteer to be the DP, but I think downgrading and signing up for another sapphire, *should* work.

chuck
chuck

I agree, I think that is true, and people are going overboard in being pessimistic about the possibility. Then again, if I had to bet, I’d bet on the pessimistic side.

Bagira
Bagira

This is horrible… Chase is getting tougher and tougher with its rules. Have CSP and was hoping to get CSR one day. Now I would need to close CSP with no guarantee of CSR being approved, so in the worst cases scenario I am at risk of not having a benefit of transferring UR points in the timeline when I hold none of Sapphire cards… am I thinking correctly here?

Lynn
Lynn

Right, I think a big risk! Either spouse or I plan to hold one of those cards before other cancels, but they could also change the transfer options between spouses, too.

Jeff
Jeff

Was waiting to get a CSP later this year. Got the CSR in March. Think I should try to get a CSP now before they change the written terms on the application page?

Jias
Jias

What a bad thing. I was waiting to be out of 5/24 next month to get a CSP and transfer all UR bonus to my CSR…

I think we should look at the third and the forth bullets together. The third bullet says that we can still downgrade or upgrade the credits within Sapphire brand (CS to CSP to CSR or CSR to CSP to CS) and get no bonus.

The forth bullet says that if you close Sapphire-branded card (including PC to Freedom-branded like Freedom or Freedom Unlimited) in the last 24 months, you will no be able to get the sign bonus.

MrDioji
MrDioji

Where did you get your parenthetical remark in your final paragraph (including PC to Freedom-branded like Freedom or Freedom Unlimited)? It does not say that, while it very easily could have.

Jias
Jias

While that is all my guess and understanding… I do not think Chase will allow you to get the bonus again within two years by simply doing the Product change to Freedom.

LAG
LAG

So long as they don’t try to shaft me out of my CSP bonus that should be posting next month I’ll be content… I received my CSR in Jan, bonus posted in Mar and just got the CSP at the end of Jul w/Bonus expected by the end of next month.

It seems that this would not be denied since I applied during the bonus before this rule was implemented… but I certainly wouldn’t put it past them to try and deny me!

Sa
Sa

on a positive note, i have an altitude reserve invitation until october,
positive for me, that is.

Joe
Joe

And this is how Chase has been planning to recoup some $$$ on the CSR all along. Those planning to dump the card after 1 year will have to think again.

Avi
Avi

Exactly, they’re offering a retention incentive instead of retention offer for the CSR

Elmer
Elmer

Or a product change dis-incentive.

Bobnoise
Bobnoise

@Greg, I’m little confused with the wording on the last bullet and your interpretation. IMO it means if you’ve closed the account (not PC’d the card), then you are not eligible for the bonus. In case i downgrade my CSP to say FU, i am assuming i can still get a CSR with the bonus as the account was not closed. My question is that when someone does a product change, does the account number change too?

Greg the Frequent Miler

I agree with your interpretation, but I’m not at all confident that Chase has coded it that way. Time will tell.

No, the account number doesn’t change.

Frank
Frank

So I was out of the game and missed the CSR big 100k. My CSP bonus was well over two years ago. If I close that account (I already have a Freedom) I should still be able to reapply for the CSP again or the CSR and get a bonus, right?

Jonathan
Jonathan

yes, as long as you’re under 5/24 (obviously)

mcafeeee
mcafeeee

You should PC to another Freedom or Freedom Unlimited. No reason to close the account.

Avi
Avi

I’ve been cooling down to 4/24 for months waiting to apply for the CSR, and now this news just killed me.

Shashi
Shashi

I see many formatting errors. I dont expect this from Chase

Captainsave
Captainsave

Im at 4/24 was stuck between csp or ink prefer. Ink it is.

MoreSun
MoreSun

Ouch… So CIP takes 5/24 into consideration but doesn’t count towards 5/24. You could have done both if you’d done CIP first. On the bright side maybe there’s another personal Chase card you’re interested in?

Captainsave
Captainsave

Damn didnt kno CIP dont count towards 5/24. Any other chase personal card worth getting beside the freedom?

MoreSun
MoreSun

Depends on your plans. Southwest, Marriott personal, & United cards should also be considered as they fall under & contribute to 5/24. Here’s Doc’s list of Chase cards & 5/24 impacted cards: https://www.doctorofcredit.com/chase-524-rule-explained-detail-need-know/#What_Cards_Does_This_Affect

Vic
Vic

This could be the worst Chase news since 5/24?
I already saw 2 data points in the past 30 minutes of being declined for CSP because already having CSR. Folks, this is real now..

Lantean
Lantean

any of those data points were from a branch app?
thanks.

Vic
Vic

No, all online.

So far I saw 3 data points.

1. Instantly approved for CSP yesterday, instantly approved for CSR this morning.

2. Have CSR. Applied for CSP online this morning, pending, called recon, declined for having CSR.

3. Have CSR. Applied for CSP online yesterday, pending (he just moved so that’s probably why it went pending), called recon, declined for having CSR.

Siddharth
Siddharth

I will be 4/24 in 3 days and had plans of applying for CSR and downgrading my CSP to Freedom Unlimited. This change threw a wrench in my plans.
I called Chase customer service and asked them about this new change. The person on the other end initially did not know about this change, but after some time he did confirm that a customer is not eligible to hold more than one Sapphire product at a time.
He also mentioned that you can’t circumvent the process by trying to downgrade CSP to Freedom Unlimited and then apply for a new CSR, as I received the signup bonus within 24 months.
So the only option for me was to upgrade my CSP to CSR, but lose signup bonus. And I did exactly the same. I think CSR is still the best card even without a signup bonus. The customer service representative changed my product to CSR in a few minutes and I will be receiving it in mail in 3 days! Been waiting for this for a long time.
I will be going to the branch in-person in 3 days once I am 4/24 and I will apply for a new Freedom Unlimited as well. Thus I will complete my Chase trifecta!

Elmer
Elmer

For those of us knowing we’re at LOL/24 and planning our strategy at other banks, this just confirms we had the right plan all along.

Vic
Vic

Exactly.

JonO
JonO

+1. And mix in some non 5/24 cards while they still exist. Just got IHG and would be tickled to see the Ritz Carlton card kick back up to 3 nights.

zalmy
zalmy

Bummer

Darv
Darv

This makes it tough because for a lot of people, it’s going to make sense to keep either a CSP or CSR to transfer points or get 1.25/1.5 in travel portal. It would seem to maximize opportunities, you would close your Sapphire card right after the 24 month mark since you last got the bonus. However, with the 5/24 restriction, there is no guarantee you can get the card back again. Most of us here would need an in-branch pre-approval and those are far from guaranteed and likely not in a timely manner, meaning you could be without a Sapphire card for months before a pre-approval pops up.

So it gets dicey.

Chase has it pretty tight now. If you’re like me and you’ve received most UR cards bonuses, not a lot of hope to accumulate a lot of UR going forward.

Yep, the game changes again and I suspect other issuers will follow Chase. There will always be good rewards to be had, but they likely won’t be nearly as plentiful in the coming years.

I would think Amex would do something soon. Even with their lifetime restriction, they’re getting hammered. It’s too easy to get their bonuses and with the influx of people into churning, a lot haven’t yet hit Amex.

Charlie
Charlie

How is Amex getting hammered?

Biggie F
Biggie F

Last summer I got the Business Gold and 75K bonus and a couple months later I got the Business Platinum and a 100K bonus and then a month after that I got the older Blue for Business and am about to finish hammering that for north of 100K. Have enjoyed some great flights in Business Class (hey, it’s all Business, right?) with the 50% MR points back deal. And I’m not even working this thing hard yet (referrals, AUs, spouse …)

Dima
Dima

You’ve done well, but that’s pretty much as far as you can take it. Maybe you’ll get another personal plat or two, maybe a PRG if you haven’t had that…but that’s about it. It’s really hard to consistently hit AMEX hard with the lifetime rule in place, even if the AMEX “lifetime” does not quite equal lifetime.

Biggie F
Biggie F

I hear you, and it would be nice to live long enough in good enough health for all this to be an issue … Just trying to make the point relative to Chase now (and even Citi with 24 mos. and their “families”) that Amex is still wide open for seizing the moment without timing things too much.

Jeff
Jeff

Amex is already once-per-lifetime bonuses. That’s probably enough for them.

Siddharth
Siddharth

I will be 4/24 in 3 days and had plans of applying for CSR and downgrading my CSP to Freedom Unlimited. With this change, what should I do now? This throws a wrench in my plans!
1) Downgrade CSP to Freedom Unlimited first, then wait and apply for CSR?
or
2) Product change CSP to CSR and lose sign-up bonus?!

TomC
TomC

I’m in the same boat. Have CSP and was going to apply for CSR + 50K and downgrade CSP to F. Now my plan is to upgrade CSP>CSR and then wait to see if there is a backlash to this Saphirre product family change by Chase and they improve Freedom product family sign up bonuses. Maybe they improve the sign up from 150 cash back (15K UR) for 500 spend to 300 cash back (30K UR) with 1000 or 1500 spend. If one of their goals is to motivate CSP customers to CSR, then this might be a good incentive.

Jon
Jon

i got both CSP and CSR at the same time over a month ago…need to finish min spend on CSR still for the bonus. i wonder if this effects that since i already earned the bonus on the CSP?

Ghie
Ghie

Jon im on the same boat.. Just got approved almost two weeks ago for CSP and will work on min spend.. Had the CSR last may.. Does it mean that i wont be affected by this change since when i got approved this wasnt the rule yet? Im planning to apply for a CFU before end of sept after 30 days of CSP since i have a preapproval offer..

D
D

So sad. Currently hold a CSR. Planned on getting a CSP this Friday when I was out of 5/24 to top of my UR balance. Talk about bad timing.

chaseaholic
chaseaholic

Can’t say I’m surprised. TBH this isn’t that bad, they could do a LOT worse. let’s not pretend that anyone here with the CSR had any legitimate intentions when they signed up for CSP #1-10.

Winter is still coming from Chase.

P
P

Minor change for me since I’m lol/24 and not gonna be out of it for years to come.

JTS
JTS

Same here, saw the article, thought “meh” not like I can apply for ANY of those cards anyways…

travelinpoints

in branch pre-approvals brother.

Dima
Dima

Good reminder for “I’ve got to hold off because I’m 9+ month away from being under 5/24” folks that they might be better off taking the good deals they see available at the moment. The rules will only keep getting tighter.

Bill M
Bill M

Right on…. I hesitated recently and had the conversation with myself about waiting for 4/24 in 9 months. I felt liberated from Chase when I decided to do an AoR last week. While I don’t foresee getting to 50/24, I now feel free to get whatever cards I want from the other issuers. I still think the likes of Southwest and Marriott should be pissed that many of their customers can’t get their affinity cards.

Lrdx
Lrdx

I’m pretty sure churners are as valuable customers to Southwest and Marriott and United as to the banks.

I.e. not at all.

Non-churners are (mostly) unaffected by these policies. Even if the partner thinks they are, they can opt out; see IHG, Hyatt, BA, Amazon, Disney, AARP..

Michael T
Michael T

How are churners not valuable to Southwest and United? They use their Chase points to fly on Southwest and United. Chase pays the airlines for the miles. They don’t get them for free.

Jack
Jack

I applied and was approved for CSP yesterday. I saw this, checked reddit, DOC and gave it a shot and was approved today for CSR. Both automatic approval online. I hadn’t applied for any personal card in 1.5 years, FICO ~800. I had 3 open chase cards prior to these.

Joe W
Joe W

Following your story… I am about to do the same (applied both at the same day) since my last Sapphire bonus is more than 3 years and i just PC my only CSP to CU. But i have to wait until Sept to get to 2/24.

Jack
Jack

It may be as simple as that these new terms were not updated on my apps when I applied. As of last night both cards appeared in my online account

Peter
Peter

So I applied for the CSR last August 2016. Got Bonus. Applied for CSP one week back in August 2017 and still am in midst of meeting the MSR to qualify for the 50K bonus. Hope I do get it or can Chase change this rule retroactively for pending bonuses?

Lantean
Lantean

So I took one for the team and went to a branch… for the first time ever i was pre-approved for NOTHING… so yeah, Chase is hard at work weeding us out…

P
P

Going in branch and asking about pre-approval is not a hard pull, I’m assuming?

Lantean
Lantean

not even a soft pull

JD
JD

It’s more of a leg pull.

Vic
Vic

Data point:

Today since this post went up, I have seen 4 data points.

2 were declined for CSP in recon call after pending for they have CSR.

2 were instantly approved for CSP while already having CSR.

My hypothesis is that this restriction is currently soft coded (enforced by lenders), but not yet hard coded.

Lantean
Lantean

can you please be specific what you mean by “soft coded”?
thanks.

CtownBin
CtownBin

I think he means that the system doesn’t reject it automatically, and if the lender you get on the recon call approves the app, it will go through. However, many lenders are manually rejecting the app if they see that you already have the other Saphirre card, probably because the rule has been circulated on their floors. This may make it tough to get approved, since you have to get a lender who doesn’t know/enforce this new rule, but not impossible since the system won’t automatically deny it (if it did, that would be hard-coded).

Lantean
Lantean

OK, thank you, that’s what I thought too.
I guess it’s worth a try to apply at this point and let the application run its course… who knows.

Vic
Vic

Yes that’s what I meant. I used some short hand to save time.

My opinion is if you feel you might get instant approval, go ahead and apply now. If you are declined, maybe get an Ink, Marriott, Southwest, Freedom to make use of the HP.

Vic
Vic

Thanks! Exactly what I meant!

CtownBin
CtownBin

I got a CSR in December 2016, and got approved for the CSP a month ago. However, I have not yet completed the minimum spend on the CSP. Will these new terms prevent me from getting the bonus points on the CSP, once I meet the spend? Or, since I applied and got approved before 8/27, I should be good?

An important question is- for someone who hasn’t received any Saphirre bonus in 24 months, would it still work to apply for both at the same time? Their system will not yet have updated that you have the other one.

lolfactory
lolfactory

Heads up, I just ran into this problem when my Reserve application was denied just now.

I was told I’m no longer eligible for bonuses on ANY Sapphire product because I had a CSP. There seems to be a lot of confusion even amongst the Chase reps because I heard about 10 different things.

A few frustrating transfers later, I asked if downgrading my CSP to a Freedom Unlimited would help. What I heard back from two different reps was that even if I did that and then got the CSR approval, I’ll never be eligible for a sign-up bonus for a CSR/CSP ever again.

Bill M
Bill M

I got CSP right before CSR was announced last year which put me at 5/24. I was bummed because I thought I would miss out on the CSR juicy 100k bonus. I went back to 4/24 in Jan 2017 and luckily was able to get CSR in branch right before the 100k went away. I just PCd the CSP directly to a 2nd Freedom about a month ago.

This change may have an impact on my decision when the CSR AF comes up in Jan. Not sure what I’ll do: 1) pay the $450 (really $150) 2) PC back to CSP for $95 or 3) say goodbye to Sapphire. My dilemma is that I have 230+k points and I have no big travel plans between now and Jan.

MoreSun
MoreSun

And that’s where I think Chase is going to get some people to stick with their CSR who otherwise would have opened a new CSP, taking the cut in point value to 1.25x but leaving the travel partner options intact. Now they can say at the end of the day CSR is really just $55 more a year than CSP… I can already here those retention phone calls.

Cain
Cain

I know my plan since they announced the 24 month bonus rule was to do CSR year one CSP year two and back to CSR year three.

MoreSun
MoreSun

Bummer. Well, you obviously weren’t alone!

NinjaX
NinjaX

crap.. i bet further change from all banks coming and INK maybe next. why not?

P
P

Hopefully not Ink.

JoVo
JoVo

If you hold one Sapphire, and already have a Freedom, wouldn’t it still make sense to cancel Sapphire after you receive the bonus and before the next annual fee and then just reapply the following year (after 24 months) to get the sign up bonus?

Charlie
Charlie

You would not be able to redeem your Freedom points at the higher Sapphire value during the time that you didn’t have a Sapphire.

Wes
Wes

And you run the risk of devaluation. Chase might start doing segmentation of the Ultimate points, making the points from Freedom family of lesser value to the one from Sapphire family.

Lap
Lap

if i open my CSP at 8/22/2015and close it at 8/1/2016. Do i still qualify for CSR bonus?

MarcoPolo
MarcoPolo

I don’t understand the “24 Month Wait for Bonus” part.
Can anyone please explain?
TIA

Alex
Alex

I read it as having two “ifs”: IF you have closed a sapphire card (or product changed?.. we don’t know) and IF you have received a sapphire new card member bonus within the past 24 months, then you will be denied another sapphire card altogether.

To me, the ambiguity lies in whether or not a product change counts as a close. It seems one definitely at least has to wait 24 months between sapphire new card member bonuses.

For example, those that got the CSR 100k in Sept 2016 have to at least wait until Sept 2018 to get another sapphire bonus (to do this though, they would need to allow you to product change to a Freedom product and not count that as a ‘closed’ sapphire card).

captainsave
captainsave

Gonna happen sooner or later. Too much churners getting in the hobby. Thats why i have a hate and love relationship with these kinda blog site.

Dima
Dima

It’s a lot tougher to play the game now than it was 2-3 yrs ago. Don’t think the issue is with the “new” churners, but mostly the “old” churners who attracted enough attention for banks to take action, and blogs like MMS that really spoon-fed readers on churning / MS techniques.

Seth
Seth

Terms on all the links I could find are now updated to state you only qualify if you don’t have any sapphire cards. Tried to apply anyway and got a pending. Decided to go for ink preferred to make use of the hard pull but got pending on that as well!

JD
JD

After getting denied the CSR last year, due to 5/24, I am pretty much done with Chase for a while. But I do like wearing the “5/24 Sucks” t-shirt that my daughter gave me.

Alex
Alex

What about those who are just authorized users?

mymyman
mymyman

This may be a dumb question, but the changes have me thinking and I was looking at the Ink Cash and Ink Preferred Offer Details and I can’t seem to find any language making you only eligible for their bonuses once every 24 months as has always been the case for most all (if not all) of chase cards. Am I missing something?

(I realize this has nothing to do with today’s changes, I just didn’t know where to talk and ask… I was thinking of opening another Ink Preferred now that I converted to Ink Cash (I also got an Ink Cash by signing up right before I converted the Preferred), then I thought “oh no dummy, you got the bonus in the last 24 months” but then I looked into the terms and I can not find the restrictive language)

Here is the card details for the main landing page of the Ink cash:

https://creditcards.chase.com/a1/olainkcash/th (then click “offer details”)

and here is a page which does contain the language when I googled for “ink cash offer details” but it shows an old offer of 20k points obviously instead of 30k .. so must be old?
https://www.chase.com/online/business-credit-cards/ink-cash-offer.htm

What gives? Thanks… go easy on me if I am missing the most obvious point ever.. LOL.

VL
VL

If you have a legit EIN to apply under (even if you have received it as SP) that will work for sure. I got it twice, once under EIN (provided my SSN as the owner/officer) and second time as SP under SSN.

I was sure that it will not work under the same SSN as SP twice… but would be funny if that is not true. Pls let us know if you go for it.

Jonathan
Jonathan

Did you apply for both for the same business? Were the business names identical? I’m interested in trying this now that CSR is no longer an option for me…

VL
VL

No, #1 was for a legitimate small corp with its own EIN (but I had to list myself as the owner and officer and provide my SSN on the application). Having mixed points reported, and keeping Amex rule in mind (where the bonus is counted per person, not the business) I was in doubts that Chase bonus can be received on a second business… but Chase apparently treats each business separately (even if the same person’s SSN is behind it). So the card #2 was for SP applying under my SSN in both boxes (EIN and officer SNN)… worked with no issues. Chase happened to be more reasonable than Amex in that respect.

zachek
zachek

Wow, that is interesting. Only problem for most of us is we are lol/24 and so wouldn’t be approved for a second CIC or CIP anyway.

VL
VL

Go to the branch with BRM and apply with him/her via a paper application.. make sure they are familiar with what it is. This will go via special lending department and they do not care about 5/24. There was a set of posts here at DoC on that, and I confirmed that as well with my BRM.

Although 100K offer expired in the end of August for such applications, 80K is still not bad at all.

Good Luck.

Cain
Cain

I’m curious why this was only found out after it was already in affect. It seems like news has always leaked out in the past well in advance of it taking affect. Maybe a lot of people were like me and called last week to downgrade before the annual fee hit for the second year and they are hoping to make that decision harder as more and more people come due. I just wish that I had applied for CSP right away instead of waiting till I received the Freedom in the mail. My original plan was to slowly get the Chase quartet of cards but by applying for the higher signup bonuses and downgrading after a year. I guess now if I want to do that I’ll have to just apply for CFU directly and wait till next year before getting a CSR/CSP again.

Charlie
Charlie

Analysts were observing several months ago that, despite the wild success of the CSR last year, Chase was not getting the kind of cardholders that it originally hoped to get: folk who would hang onto the card for many years, enjoying the regular benefits and exhibiting brand loyalty. Instead, Chase got a younger crowd that tends not to be brand loyal and who values signup bonuses more than regular benefits. Chase’s decision to reduce the signup bonus and to eliminate the double travel credit the first year are both evidence of their awareness of this problem. I think you might be right that the number of downgrades in the last week spooked them, so they quickly adjusted to stem their losses.

Cain
Cain

The ironic thing for me personally is I was trying to move slowly into the complete Chase family of cards for all of my spending, but I had moved into the BoA Preferred Rewards familiy of cards, from Amex, just before CSR was announced so I had limited room under their 5/24 rule to do it all at once. All of their rules made it harder for me to switch to them.

Charlie
Charlie

Yep, I had been planning to move all my spending to Chase, too, by adding the CFU and CF to my existing CSR. Ironically, Chase’s cardholder survey with the three ugly alternatives came out a few weeks before I dropped from 5/24 to 3/24, so I made an abrupt change of plans and got the PenFed Power Cash instead of the CFU. I will probably get the new NFCU Amex next month instead of the CF. Instead of a Chase “trifecta,” I will be using three cards from three different financial institutions.

Dave
Dave

If my credit line is 1000 on my freedom and they give me the option to pc to csr is it worth it to do the pc now or wait a few months till I’m out of 5/24
(Though I currently have a csp)

YRK
YRK

Almost identical predicament.
Have CSP 6months old , and Freedom 16month with CL of 4500.
I SM if I can convert , got no for CSP as under 1year but for freedom said will consider after apply and get approved for CLI to atleast 10k.
Am currently 6/24.

Kevin
Kevin

So, who’s going to be the first DP to find out if you can still get a CSR and a CSP by applying for both in 1 day? You can already get around 5/24 by applying for 2 Chase personal cards on the same day when at 4/24. I wonder if applying for CSR and CSP same day in different browsers might work too.

Kevin
Kevin

Apparently, on Reddit, we have the first DP of someone who applied for both the CSR and the CSP on the same day and got approved for both…

Jake
Jake

Any reason /not/ to product change my new Chase Sapphire Preferred (via Chase Fairmont conversion) to a Chase Freedom (would be my 2nd) or Freedom Unlimited (would be my 1st)?

As DoC reported, going forward, folks can only sign up for the Chase Sapphire Reserve OR the Preferred. I have and plan to keep my Reserve — and therefore think product changing to another Freedom makes sense. Thoughts?

MoreSun
MoreSun

Nothing to lose there since you’re keeping your Reserve.

Charlie
Charlie

Have there been any data points on whether “Selected For You” offers can bypass the restriction on receiving any Sapphire card within 24 months of receiving a bonus? I’m military and currently have a Chase Sapphire Preferred obtained through the “Selected For You” loophole, and received a bonus earlier this year. I’m considering product changing to a Chase Freedom Unlimited to open up the possibility of being selected for a CSR now that I can obtain it without paying annual fees.

William Charles

Don’t think I’ve seen any yet

Michael
Michael

Can anyone shed light on the impact this has with JPM Reserve? Can someone with a JPM Reserve still be approved for a Sapphire Preferred? or Reserve?

Technically speaking – the JPM Reserve is not a Sapphire product, though it has similar / almost identical benefits.

weima
weima

I have long time CSP and just cleared 5/24 and applied for CSR. Downgraded CSP to FU, they told me I can’t get CSR bonus. Can only PC from CSP to CSR.

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